| We Love The P-47 |
| - |
| Last update - 12 January 1999 |
| - |
Posted by: Ronin Posted on: 13:11:45 11/05/98 Posted from: Subject: P-47 Curious Message: So I decided to graduate myself from being TnB'er into an E-fighter. I've mostly been mucking around with the F4U when I can, but lately, the P-47 has caught my eye (mainly because of stimpy's "Chicks dig me..." mousepad :) In the past, I have rarely seen in in the MA. So I'm wondering, is there anyone out there who flies the Jug, and what can you tell me about it? Ronin Corsair straight, but T-bolt curious |
 |
Posted by: iddon Posted on: 23:56:43 11/05/98 Message: Ronin, If you want to know how the P47 really performs, check out my flight test pages. As Jim Carey says "I like it !!" Grant Iddon
Posted by: Vicious ~Hell's Aces~ Posted on: 23:01:59 11/05/98 Message: : Ronin : Corsair straight, but T-bolt curious Ah yes, the Jug is a sight to behold and a power not to be placed into the hands of children. The P47 is one of the most misunderstood planes in the game. At first glance it's a flying monstrosity. Upon first flight, it seems even worse! Don't be deceived, this plane is one of the deadliest in the air. It's only drawback is it's difficulty to learn. The steep learning curve leads many people to underestimate it's capabilities. The majority of enemy aircraft I encounter simply ignore me, or assume I am an easy kill and throw caution to the winds. Climbing towards a fast Jug flown by an E-savvy pilot is suicide. The kill markers painted on my Jug's fuselage are testimony to this truth. Be prepared Ronin to suffer while you learn the nuances of real energy fighting. I've seen others post suggestions to run at every opportunity and only pick off stragglers or those without the SA to see you coming. That's rediculous! I've flown the Jug as the superiority fighter it is since it was first unleashed on the arena. I can tell you first hand that it has served me well, even in extreme knife fights. I'm proud to say my longest sreak of 61 kills was done in the P47 in only two days. Don't underestimate it's abilities. Dadi is right, I've written several training documents on this plane, but I'm afraid those are proprietary to Hell's Aces. I'd be shot for treason if I posted them here. I will give you some tips, however. The Jug is essentially three things: speed, fire power, and mass incarnate. In any fight maintain your velocity to the best of your ability. Enter all engagements with enough energy to complete your maneuvers. For instance, don't enter a fight if you're practically hanging on your prop, or at an obvious E-disadvantage. After you've learned the plane you'll recognize the dweebs who will lay their energy at your feet. You have my permission to carve them up. Fire power: 8 .50s are every opponents nightmare. It's up to you to make that nightmare real. Excellent gunnery in the Jug is almost mandatory since you generally have few opportunities to waste during a fight. Poor E-fighters will give you more chances to kill them, while the good pilots may give you one, or two. Cultivate long range gunnery (500-700 yrds) and you'll almost never lose. Historically, my gunnery hovers around 25%, but on a good night it's in the 30-40%s. Practice offline until you are confident. Mass, don't overlook it. The P47 is heavy and it's got an enormous engine. Keep all of your maneuvers in the vertical. Worr is right when he points out that you can learn a lot from training in any plane. But, the Jug is so unforgiving that when you do something wrong you know it. If you lose your E advantage during any fight you need to analyze where that energy is going. Odds are you're flying in the horizontal and giving your victories away. That huge engine has two graces, you can run from anyone by simply pointing the nose down and you can hang on your prop for an epoch. That's a piece of gold right there, you'll need to practice to find out what I mean. Vertical, vertical, vertical. . .I won't say any more. There is nothing more satisfying than engaging two KI84s at coalt and shooting the cockey bastards down (unless you kill the same two several times in one sortie). Believe me I've done it. I've spent hours roving back fields fighting against greater numbers and I've been rewarded with addreneline that can't be supplied by the 'lesser' planes. Given the chance, I'll only fly the Jug. The plane has limitations too, but you'll do better to learn those yourself. Analyze each engagement you lose and you'll learn how to read the arena. You'll learn how to gauge the enemies energy state DURING every fight and you'll learn how to exploit your own energy state. In the end you will fly all of the fighters better because you will have learned how to avoid energy draining maneuvers. You will also recognize when your enemy makes a poor dicision. Good luck and godspeed Ronin. The Jug is an energy fighters dream. Vicious aka --vics Hell's Aces Wing Leader Jadgstoffeltoten Former HA Training Officer
Posted by: boomr- Posted on: 21:03:36 11/05/98 Message: Way back in 1.11 days I went by the name 'tigh,' I was getting bored with the game and something sick and twisted went off in my head. Score was meaningless and I was too impatient for the conservative flying that can yield double digit streaks and so I finally realised that the whole reason I got a kick out of the game was the satisfying kills. I decided that the most satisfying kills in the game were buffs so I figured a way to hunt them that was near foolproof. In case your new, in the most common MA map, purps were at the bottom with golds to the left and reds to the right. There would, as is typical of Warbirds, usually be a general furball on one side of your territory. What I would do is hunt around 12k(the fields were closer then) on the opposite side of the furball. My fav spot was on the east side n of the big mountain just past purplandia's easternmost field. It seemed the golds had more buffers (real, not ackstars) than the reds. Using this strategy, I had an almost endless supply of unescorted buffs coming in ones and twos. So then I had to choose a plane. The fw190 was my first ride for this mission, but there was no satisfaction there, the paper buffs of 1.11 would almost always blow up, so what's the point? I might as well be furballing. I needed a cannonless aircraft, so I switched to the p51. I was in love, I felt like the spawn of hell. I could sit back with my devious grin and shoot up the b17's untill they were a smoking, limping, wreck without them blowing up instantly. No two deaths were the same. I know it's pretty weird but it just seemed cool to me at the time to know that there was some guy who spent 20 minutes climbing to attack an undefended field only to go spiraling to the deck sans wing. The thought of carving off a wing seemed more, well, personal than sending em back to the tower with an explosion. Many times, if I could take out at least one control surface and some engines I'd let em go. Always if the damage included a fuel leak. It seemed even more satisfying when they'd try to nurse it home and wipe out on the runway. I'd eagerly keep watch over the text buffer for the kill. It became an art, really, a challenge. Shooting up a plane bad enough that the pilot couldn't make it back but not so bad that he wasn't willing to try. There was a problem though, the p51 didn't have the ammo load to get 2 buff kills in a sortie the *way* I wanted to do it. I couldn't choose a plane with cannons and I remembered seeing that the jug had 8 50's and a lot of rounds. The Jug seemed a dog then, noone ever flew it or really understood it's strengths and weeknesses, including me. I figured though, that all I needed were the guns. I wasn't after all, furballing so it didn't matter. I chose the Jug and it fit the bill beautifully. I could get 2 sick twisted buff kills with the Jug per sortie without blowing up the planes. This was cool! Something odd happened then. Occasionally when the fronts would move I'd have other targets of opportunity. I usually didn't worry about them unless I fealt threatened but occasionally I would dive on 190's. I really hated the BnZ 190's then and I started to figure something out. The Jug was fast, real fast, and it held onto e real well. So well in fact that I could usually run down the 190's with a slight alt adv. This was greatly satisfying as well, just because the 190 drivers really were invincible for the most part in 1.11. But noone, it seemed, really understood the jug and so if you were on many of these guys sixes they'd just stay trimmed out. I'd always get a kick out of thinking that some guy was eating a sandwich and patting himself on the back for a mission well done only to start hearing pings a second later from the plane he been ignoring. Pretty twisted I know, but the truth aint always pretty, although sometimes humorous. Too be honest, I'm starting to prefer other planes. With the new maps and ever improving players in the game (who are familiar with the jug), You rarely see unescorted small groups of bombers. Additionally, the increasing alt of engagements makes the Jug's poor rate of climb somewhat frustrating. I will fly the Jug on occasion still, though usually only when I get really, really pissed :) Boomr-
Posted by: Jim Rauch aka luzr of the VF-101 Grim Reapers Posted on: 15:50:18 11/05/98 Message: I take this bird out on occaision and all the rules I use for the FW I use on the Jug, and these have all been mentioned. I would caution you regarding a turn fite against a 190, though. Depending on fuel load and version you could wind up screwed. The A4 does a bit better I think, and those 4x20mm make snapshots pretty deadly. Remember that 2 of the cannons are in the wing root, so the convergance isn't so much of a disadvantage for the FW. Now, if you tag someone with the P-47's 8x.50s at convergence the poor guy (gal) will think they fell into a running Cuisinart! I'd say stick to the BnZ with lotsa smash and take on only the folks that you can sneak up on. Use the pray 'n spray method - I've gottena lot of "lucky" shots when I was just trying to "sight in" using my tracers! Ammo load is one of it's advantages, so don't be afraid to use it. Do NOT succumb to the desire to turn like you can in an F4U. Be patient above all. I had a very frustrating time once trying to tag a P-47 with my Spit V when my wingie and I were vulching his field. He scooted out under the flak and got up a head of steam. He NEVER got above me, but he never let his speed drop either. I gave him very few opportunities to get snap shots on me, but he was running the show - I kept having to fly back and knock down the zekes and spits lifting off as he tried to drag me on a long cross country. I couldn't catch him at all. After the ack had chewed on me and I ran out of canno ammo I headed for home. Guess who showed up with an extra 5k over me? Let's just say I had a very interesting landing approach. If you run into a zeke go ahead and dogfite with him, but stay in the vertical until you're co-e. Then run like hell and extend until he gets bored. Reverse and go for the snap shot. Try and lure the Spits and Zeke's into HO. That radial makes great armor ;) luzr out
Posted by: -bmbm-, CO RSAF Posted on: 14:52:19 11/05/98 Message: Lots of good tips around here, I'll just add a few: Don't ever turn with anything unless you start out with a huge overhead of E, typically 100+ knots or 5-6K. This overhead allows you to keep boomzooming for a while. However, the Jug will outturn FW's and can stay with the Pony for a short while - again given a small extra stash of smash. I never fight co-alt inbound cons. Run like hell. I never fight hi-alt cons (unless I'm zooming hard in their low six or low twelwe. Climb until you're fairly certain no one is above you. I usually roll my Jug topped to 100% - down to 60% if I have an immediate agenda. Reason why: since I will be extending and climbing far more than I'm attacking, I need the extra gas to allow multiple engagements in any one sortie. I make one-shot passes, extend and look for fresh victims. If the guy breaks off or display awareness, I simply steam past looking for the unaware. BB, out
Posted by: stimpy (Rogue Gryffons) Posted on: 14:47:52 11/05/98 Message: Ahhh my loveable Jug... There is nothing like it. You can fly your uber planes until your head explodes, but nothing quite feels like landing a mission in a Jug even if you only got one kill. The best way I like to fly it is in tandum with mikess. No one expects two P-47s to be lite and 99 times out of 100 you shread people who dare take you on solo. The other time is from a crappy HO :) Wingman and the P-47C is almost a necessity. Without iMOL worrying about artwork and making every other plane under the sun that no one flies to often (i.e. Stuka), we may not see it for a while... Just fix the back view is all I can ask. But, as a gun platform, I believe the P-47 is a worthy contender until the end of uberweek when everyone outclasses you since the P-47N (or M for us lite flies who dont care bout them bombs :) isn't available. It is great taking people on in it. Huge E retention, zoom climbs are a great way to get away from people if you have the speed. Or just let her drop til you pick up 450, 500IAS and then just ride it level til you hit 400IAS, then drop another "step" til you are back up to 500IAS. People can't keep up (well most planes :). Put the sucker's nose to the ground, and watch it drop like a brick. Nothing is stopping it once it is in a dive, except cold packed earth. Stall shots are great when you are 90 degrees straight up, at a dead standstill and spraying upwards at a con... It ticks em off when you hit them :) Great surface response at all speeds except past MACH 3 :) If we had their performance modeled right, it would be seen much more often. But since they are considered a "closet" plane now, only the elite fly them. We need more people to grobble so the American fighter that had the most kills in the war can be reproduced accurately. Throw in the M and N versions and watch out ;) stimpy
Posted by: Crapgame, + Hell's Aces Squadron Posted on: 14:23:10 11/05/98 Message: I don't know about expert but since the Jug is the only plane I fly once it appears I'll offer some tips. The Jug as modelled in WB has some things going for it. It has a very good roll rate, tremendous dive and a shitload of ammo for those chainsaw .50's. The view needs to be addressed and the C model is somewhat more manueverable than the D. Taking 40% fuel will allow you about a 30 minute flight while not penalizing your already impaired manueverability. As others have mentioned, I like to get alt, usually between 12-15k in the MA and set a hard deck of 5K. I only go below that if I can do so with tremendous energy. The Jug absolutely shines in high speed gun passes. This baby can make a stable gun pass at 450 IAS no problem and won't compress until close to 500 IAS. Use the roll rate when forced to go defensive and keep that nose pointed down to garner speed...nothing will catch you in a dive. When offensive I like to use barrel rolls to line up my target. You've got a lot of ammo so don't be shy about spraying it out there to line up the shot. If you happen to fly purp, Vicious. vics-- is undoubtedly the best Jug pilot out there. He routinely racks up 12+ kill sorties and I've personally witnessed two sorties where he racked up 16 kills. Jester. -jstr- is also deadly in the Jug as well as -bmbm-. You can look any of us up and I'm certain anyone would be happy to help you out. Crapgame, -cpgm- < C/O Hell's Aces Sqdn.
Posted by: =worr= Posted on: 14:12:08 11/05/98 Message: This isn't the the initiator of this post, but it is something worthy to be said, I think, about "air craft specialists". In the training arena its usually the newer guy who says, "I want to be trained in the XXXXX" But what they really need to know if how to execute a flat turn. I'm not suggesting you need no learn the secrets of the P-47, but most of the "secrets" are very much universal. The Jug is my most favortie plane to fly on line, but the D is so late in the rotation and then soon outclassed that I'm not always in it and the C is, well....we all know about that. The secret to the JUG is simply understanding inertia, and then its design limitations where are widely publisized--poor turn rate, great roll rate, strength at alt, large power boost in WEP, etc. But never be ashamed of learning the basics. I had a guy in training last month who had been flying for three years! And he came away with a pocket full of tricks and the tricks apply across the board. Basically you can fly all 50 planes two ways. Add to this a solid knowledge base of strengths and weakness, and yes what it means when you fill ping pong balls with sand, and away you go! Worr, out
Posted by: Rojo (S-2, The Buccaneers) Posted on: 13:48:49 11/05/98 Message: Every once in a while, I get the hankering to take a Jug up. Its climb rate, roll rate and speed at altitude seems to be a bit undermodelled, as is its durability. Nonetheless, this aircraft was the mainstay of the US tactical airforces in Europe from its introduciton to the German surrender. It was well liked by allied pilots (both American and British), and respected by the German pilots. So I can't resist the occasional urge to take one up in WarBirds. This aircraft has earned the reputation in WB of being an "expert's" plane. This in and of itself should tell you it hasn't been modelled correctly, since in real life it was considered a solid and pilot-friendly combat aircraft. Most of the rules that apply to flying the FW190 and Corsair apply to the Jug, except you can't rely on the a phenominal roll rate when you go defensive in a fight. Take off well away from the fight, climb to 15k or more and establish a hard-deck of around 5k (i.e. never go below this in the course of air-2-air combat. If attacking ground targets, only go below this 5k altitude if you have sufficient speed ("smash" in the the parlance of the fighter pilot) to zoom back above it. This applys even if you're attacking a ground target, and even if there are currently no enemy planes around. The Jug's abismal climb rate won't allow you to get back to altitude in time, even if you spot an enemy fighter at max range. What does the Jug do well? Eight, count'em, eight 50 cal. machine guns and a warehouse full of ammo, for one thing. Couple this arsenel with a very stable gun aiming platform and you have the American equivalent of the "Butcher Bird." I happen to be one of those NOT offended by the "spray and pray" tactic. Why do you think Republic put 33% more firepower and 50% more ammo load on this beast than was standard for other US fighters of the day? If I've got a fleeing Stang or FW at D8 and wings-level, I'll take the shot and use half my ammo if necessary. The P-47 is also pretty fast on the deck, and handles well at extreme (25K plus) altitude. The Jugs other primary attribute is a large air2ground loadout. However, the F4U, P-38, and P-51D all can carry a similar load; since these other planes' modelling makes them better dog-fighters as well, they attract more WB pilots. Hence, the Jug's rare apperance in the MA. Hope my ramblings have been helpfull. Rojo
Posted by: -snot-, CO/6th Air Commando Group Posted on: 13:28:10 11/05/98 Message: The T-Bolt is a great fighter. 8 .50 cal machineguns, can carry 3 500lb bombs and 10 rockets, or 2 1000lb 'ers... so it can move mud. When flown properly (erm... not by me), it is a deadly E-fighter. One of the best things about a Jug is that it has the superhuman acceleration in a dive. In trouble? Roll 'er over, point the nose at the deck.. watch how quickly that speed builds up! Andy
ik Jagdgeschwader 77 posted 12-21-98 05:26 AM ET (US) I flew the p47 a bunch tonight, kinda rediscovered what fun that bird is! Big guns, durable, fast. I noticed there's no other plane guys seem to hate being killed by, and no other plane they love to kill more! I got to thinking, and i noticed that the P-47 seems very neglected in our Scenario Lites. Even during this last Bodenplatte SL, the p47 was nowhere to be seen. I know the P-47 was one of the primary allied fighters on the continent at that time too! I've never seen a P-47 b17 escort SL, and it's been ages since they've graced the reduced icon skies. What gives? I'm looking to fly one! Tchüß ik "I fly close to my man, aim well, and then he falls down." -Oswald Boelcke Daff RSAF posted 12-21-98 06:39 AM ET (US) Heh..for once I agree with you, Ik :P But..in many ways, the P47 is one of the hardest plane to fly..it takes a very disciplined & patient pilot. On top of that, it doesnt get used much in the MA..I fly it a fair bit, but it's a plane that fairs best in historical surroundings...Before and after pointblank, I saw a lot of people flying the 47C in the MA, most likely because they wanted the practice. Hopefully the "Zemke's Wolfpack" HA, will bring some of those people out of the closet. Daff macker posted 12-21-98 06:43 AM ET (US) IK, I luv the P47 and when I was online in 1.11, I would fly it high and hunt alot. IMO there is no other plane that can match it in high E fighting. Very manueverable at high speed and deadly even at high closure (assuming the convergence is high enough). But you and I know that high E fighting along with lag rolls and barrel roll attacks take time to learn and many kills require patience. As the P47 Scorts: I belong(ed) to the 305thBG(H) squad and we would go into all the scenarios where bombing was needed and we had a mission with P47 scort. Although I was flying in d0 formation in a B17, I would have rather been in the jug circling high over the formation P47 cockpit check: Cigar, 45 automatic, rubbers and whiskey Macker (formerly MCCF in 1.11) SnakeEyes posted 12-21-98 12:36 PM ET (US) I love the 47D. Not a big fan of the C though... can't stand the 6-view or the abysmal climbrate. In the name of play balancing, I suggest that all lite P-47s should receive a 5K air start. o-o-o- "SnakeEyes" XO Fourth Fighter Group Jester posted 12-21-98 02:17 PM ET (US) a few of us Hell's Aces fly the jug alot. blackflight was supposed to be "Zemkes wolfpack" and had the most aces in that major scenario (i forgot the name already---<takes another bong hit> ) that was fun. the 47D is a force to be reckoned with. however, its not a co alt fighter. it seems alot slower from 1.11 - present wb and i have been bitching for years that roll rate has been dumbed down from version 1.11 - present day wbs. ------------------ Jester ~Hell's Aces~ Ram1 posted 12-21-98 02:36 PM ET (US) It was Pointblank [WarBirds scenario 1998 - front] Jester that featured the P47 and Blackflight led by Vila I believe. Other groups of P47's were used with P51's to escort bomber formations during that scenario. In that scenario, the P47's acquitted themselves nicely I do believe. ram1 ik Jagdgeschwader 77 posted 12-21-98 02:39 PM ET (US) Also, the P47 out rolled the p51, and was supposed to have been the only allied fighter able to roll with the FW190, and in warbirds this is simply not true. Also, with no fuel in the wings it's roll response seems questionable, perhaps should be a bit more f4u like? Tchüß ik "I fly close to my man, aim well, and then he falls down." -Oswald Boelcke jedi posted 12-21-98 02:54 PM ET (US) And another thing... Why the heck don't they use the P-40/P-51B art for the 47C??? The Val/Kate and Oscar/Frank prove that you can have pretty much whichever art you want for whichever plane. Is the Hellcat art really closer to the Jug-C than the P-40 art would be? To me, the whole LW conspiracy thing is just something to poke fun at, but when you see a US plane with added disadvantages built in for no reason, ya gotta wonder ;-) For that matter, why not put the Corsair art on the Hellcat and shut up all us artwork dweebs (temporarily)? D'oh! Wrong topic! :-) jedi IDIAMN 1 JG27 AFRIKA posted 12-21-98 03:20 PM ET (US) Ye olde jug is downright entertaining, like flying a rhino. You just cant kill them damn things, well....EASILY that is. So theres this zeke right....and he decides he wants to try and chase my p47 at about 10k or so....I'm allready movin' out at about 300 or so, anyway, this guy is following me and so I figure what the hell??? I was rtb'n after droppin some ord on an nmy airfield and wasnt really lookin' for a fight, but there he is.... "maybe he'll realize the futility of his effort...." Thought I. Nope, he's still tryin to get me. I try to avoid H.O.'s cause they tend to irritate the hell outa me, but it's about the only thing I could do against a zeke..... So I dive to pick up more speed, climb and reverse and come barreling straight in at this poor zeke who keeps right on coming... "is this guy for real...??" Thought I. Sure as squat he decides to head-on my jug, I fire off a burst, miss, cuss and keep right on goin', didnt even ping em or get pinged, so I do it again, and lo and behold so did mr zeke...this time I ripped off one of his wings, and Rtb'd giggling the whole damn way. Silly I swear. Dude was obviously new and I let him know the futility of flying a balsa wood aircraft H.O. vs a tank of a bird like the jug. Was funny as hell at the time tho...geesh, killer zeke. "Hey...nice cannons" Idi Fryorb posted 12-21-98 11:08 PM ET (US) Let me say this is sort of a mixed bag of things... And that I am sorry if this is a rant... 1) I have flown the Jug h2h and been complimented on how I handle the plane (I love the plane for mud moving). The Jug was supposed to have one of if not the fastest roll rates of any US fighter during WWII (but it doesnt seem that way. In Warbirds the F4F seems to have the fastest roll rate of the US planes (I may be rong, but to me it seems more manuveral then the F6F(which was supposed to be a better match for the Zero). 2)Also the terraines either need to be more spread out or have a fairly high air start(10,000 ft) to alow for high alt fights where planes like the Jug and Runstang would shine. Adding high alt combat would probably change the style of game play a certaine extent. 3)Also makeing the bomb sights less acurate(in all planes, they all seem lasser guided to me) and more of a bomb impact dispersal would make it necessary to use more of a carpet bombing teqnique( I don't think I have seen any WWII bombing footage where the bombe hit in a single file line. 4)Being able to control the CV would be/will be a must if it is to be implimented in a strat style of game(and haveing it be able to be sunk by torps, bombs, a hell of alot of strifing, or even Kamikazies {baka bombs would be nice for this} would be nice). And one new terraine that would be nice is an acurate Pacific Theater terraine(I am not for sure if the current PAC/AWT terraine is acurate to any extent). 5)Adding ROTO packs to German planes, and the addition of the Me-163 Komet would possibly make it more intersting, if not more dangerous, to attack airfields and cities close to airfields. And adding smaller airstrips close to or in the cities would make for a more interesting game IMHO. Wells posted 12-22-98 02:46 AM ET (US) I think the P-47's roll inertia is way overdone. Compared to the F4u (similar wingspans areas and weight, the P-47 also uses an elliptical planform which moves the center of mass of the wing closer to the fuse and further from the ailerons. It doesn't have the folding wing mechanism found in the F4u's wing design. It's landing gear retracts inwards, further moving the wing mass closer to the fuse. There is no fuel contained in the wings. The only thing going against it, is 2 extra guns and the ammo that goes with it. That would stand to equalize the 2 comparisons somewhat. I was thinking that maybe, they've (IMOL) decided to go halfway on the inertia between having bombs/rockets fitted and having nothing. This would make sense if they don't model the change in inertia from dropping bombs/rockets and/or firing ammo. If that is the case, then the P-47 is at a disadvantage there, because it carried it's bombs much further out on the wings than did the F4u, which carried them close to the fuse, inboard of the landing gear. The total weight of the wings is almost the same as 1 1k bomb, so this would make a huge difference in the roll inertias. Bombom posted 12-22-98 05:27 AM ET (US) Jedi spake thusly: I I have to agree that the P40 art does more justice than the F6F art, although the rear/side views appear slighty too generous for the 47C (this without having sat in one). EAW has a nice P47C cockpit with good visibilty to the side/rear, and is certainly very much better than the F6F art. Now, the canopy framework is REALLY irritating/conspicous though, what with a central strut obscuring the target a few vital degrees to the left of the gunsight. Still want that momma! The JugC is a sweet plane. Just bring a wingman and that horrible rear view becomes a non-factor. As for climbing and airstarts (please, NOT!), Pointblank practice was to WEP to redline or 10K at 145 knots, then speed up 5 knots or so every 5K up to 30K. Time to altitude is approx 4min/10K, 7,5min/15K, 11min/20K and 15min/25K - this with 100% gas. Not too bad for a flying tank! Re tactics, I but never accept coalt-coE fights in the Jug. So, I'm a sissy, but I like to land. BB, out -bmbm-, CO Royal Swedish Air Force Fighting for Bullens Pilsnerkorv and lukewarm beer worldwide nrts posted 12-22-98 12:46 PM ET (US) Flew the P47 mostly this weekend. Got a small 14-streak in it. Gotta love it with the extra ammo load! I seemed to be able to run home when in trouble with little difficulty. Even though other aircraft have higher top speeds the P47 seems to retain E in a dive and level run very nicely. A little patience getting alt otw to target area really pays off. I typically boom with near-vertical zoom as the jug hammerheads obediently. -nrts- 335thFS 4thFG |